Friday, March 15, 2013

Something I Want Everyone To Know

Listen: In the last year or so, every time I have blogged something "negative" about the Traditional Catholics, a big part of me feels bad and guilty. I am being totally honest about this.

Many times I have considered swearing off blogging about TRAD stuff, knowing it's bad for my soul. It's been confessional material more than once, trust me.

But there is a part of me that when I see extreme uncharitability and general unkindness on the part of Traditional Catholics, etc. - that I just can't shut my mouth. I want to speak up and point it out.

This is probably too much personal information, but I'll share it anyway: I talk about this subject over and over with my very orthodox Catholic therapist. The bottom line always ends up that I need to be who I am, and that perhaps my pointing out the negative aspects of the Traditional Catholics is doing someone a favor somewhere because there really is much wrong with the mindset of Traditional Catholics.

I know I get people upset when I say things like this. But how many times do I have to make the cliche disclaimer that when I say these things I'm not speaking of ALL Traditional Catholics? Doesn't that go without saying? People want me to have a blanket charitably that never allows for criticism or testing, and I think that's unreal and unfair. Nothing is perfect.

Now, this leads to the very obvious question: What's it to you, Char?

That's a good question and I don't have an answer. Sometimes I've come to the conclusion that the TRAD topic has nothing at all to do with me, and thus I ought to shut up.I mean, it's not like I'm a Latin mass person!

But then I ask myself why the nastiness and negativity of some Traditional Catholics always gets me fired up? Sorry, but I don't have an answer to that other than I am really sensitive to bullying and underdogs. I know the TRADS believe THEY are the ones who are the underdogs, and that might be true. But the ones being bullied are absolutely the non-TRADS. Regular Catholics are routinely bullied by the Traditional Catholics and I hate it, since I tend to place a higher standard of Christian behavior on them, since they have voluntarily subscribed to - and more importantly - loudly proclaimed a higher standard of Catholicism.

That's all I've got right now. I say all this because I really, really, really, really, really want to write a blog post absolutely slamming the Traditional Catholics for what I've read out there in terms of their response to the new pope.

Some will say: Don't do it, don't be uncharitable, don't add fuel to the fire.

I say: Not sure yet. Because I have a clever approach for what I want to say. And I think what I want to say has some value.

Trust me, I have other things to blog about, that I have lined up in my head. But still, what I've seen in the last 2-3 days just gnaws at me to get out.

If it does come out, again, I will feel badly about saying it. I know I don't come off that way, but please know, I do have twangs and twinges of regret.


  1. The idea that you should never criticize any trad thing that you get hit with when you comment is aking to the Legion's twisting of charity. It's a ploy to squelch questioning. Speak with true charity - truth in love. Speak directly to the action, not the person-as you can never know their intention or state of their soul.

  2. Charlotte,

    Why not look on the bright side, because there is a lot of it to look at. I have my own gripes about traditionalist types, but their errors are typically ordered to the Will of the Church but in some manner missing the mark. Which is very different than those who reject the Church or want to change the Church into their own image.

    Unlike some such as Mark Shea, I've never seen your comments as uncharitable.

    And strangely enough the only comments I've ran across by flesh and blood traditionalists is they're pleased with his simplicity, and hope that other clerics will follow the Holy Father's example of not only not expecting to be pampered, but eschewing the pampering.

    1. Ltg, that was the best comment ever from you. And I mean that.

  3. Jabberwocky3/15/13, 4:30 PM

    Mean people suck.

    And if they are trads/"conservative"/"orthodox"/whatever-it-is-they-call-themeselves and mean and nasty, it's a double whammy because they are claiming to be so much holier than everybody else.

    Really maddening! This is what gets my goat, and it's not just with Trads, it's with a whole lot of so-called "orthodox" Catholics as well.

    And it's not just on the internet; I've seen plenty of this meanness (often under the guise of some pious language) in real life. Like I've said before, I grew up in these circles. What is said on the internet might be more vicious, but I think that is simply the anonymity of the internet allowing people to say what they really think without even having to bother cushioning it in pious-talk.

    It's not like plenty of society is not mean. But at least general society isn't telling us they have the Way, the Truth, and the Light while they are being mean and nasty.

    It's the using of religion to feel superior and to beat people with that I find particularly disgusting.

  4. I would like to hear more about this..."Regular Catholics are routinely bullied by the Traditional Catholics." IRL? On the internet? I am definitely not bullied by them IRL because there are only about a hundred of them down in this little church and they are so toxic they drive people away like mace. So yes, please do write this post. I would also like to hear how your silent retreat went, did I miss that?

    Viva il Papa!


    1. Once in a while, we'll go to the Latin Mass at a local parish. It is well attended, and I prefer more traditional forms of the liturgy (even when Protestant, I was never a bongos and guitars, praise music type of worshiper).

      I wrote about a particularly bad experience here:

      And yeah, I'd say this was bullying. Now, whether or not this lady was a member of the parish, I don't know. I've been back a handful of times since and I have never seen her again.

      But I do know this: while we like the liturgy and the order that staffs this particular parish, we're hesitant to join because we'd be seen as the "squishy" liberals with our views on certain things (like the genuine Catholic definition of "social justice," etc.)

    2. Catlady, I don't know about in real life so much as regular Catholics are absolutely positively bullied by TRADS on the internet.

      We are bullied because of the TRADS' automatic assumption of being better-read, better-researched, and more intelligent, etc., than the non-TRAD. They can quote councils and canons and we can't (supposedly). They can name every piece of cloth a priest is wearing and every vessel on the altar. They can read Latin and pronounce it correctly. They know every time a priest slips up - in Latin!

      The rest of us? Ignorant, uneducated pions who know nothing of Catholic history, the REAL mass, or the Church's true teachings. THAT'S how we get bullied. Even if it's with the "canned" arguments like, "Aren't you moved that the saints of all ages were fed from the Traditional liturgy?" - the assumption is there that we hadn't thought it through enough to figure out that St. Therese attended the old form of the mass.

      Again, as this post says, it's not all TRADS. But it's there, in spirit, most of the time, even if it's not blatant and/or intentionally nasty.

    3. @Charlotte...yeah, that I would agree with. It's the nature of the internet. It's also the nature of feeling so strongly about things. Regular Catholics don't get that worked up about being...regular. The internet is just a messed up place though, it brings out the worst in everyone. I know trads IRL and I'm sure they would have comments about what I do, but since it's real life, we all tend to have better manners than that. But they could be pounding away on their keyboards at night and I wouldn't know it.


    4. @AmyP yes, Mass is not all about us! In fact, it's not supposed to be about us at all. That's funny about the bongos, I just started going to a new parish after going through a painful experience and it is so full of love and joy and Christ. And bongoes and guitars : ) God has a sense of humor, doesn't he?

    5. Sorry that was me Catlady at 1056

  5. Post it when you feel called to Char. As a Blessed JP the Great said... Be Not Afraid. Worrying about what Trads will say is akin to me worrying about what pro-aborts will say when I mention I'm post abortive, thus not sharing my insights and/or opinions as to why abortion is wrong. God uses all of us because He's given us all gifts that He needs us to use to promote His will. Use yours for good and you'll never go wrong. Even if that means hurting a couple feelings in the mean time. Maureen is right... one of my Priests used to say "In necessariis unitas, in dubiis libertas, in omnibus caritas" which means - "In necessary things unity, in doubtful things liberty, in all things charity."